Recker Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 Got out to the river today to do some rock hounding, I think I've found a fossilized corn cob LOL. Honestly, I have no idea what this could possibly be a tool, concretion, fossil or just weird rock. The exposed end has a scallop like design, longitudinal grooves of some sort while the other end seems hollow to a point. It's weighty. What do you think? Found on the Whitewater River, Franklin County, Southeast Indiana. Thanks so much!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockwood Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 Crinoid caylx that's been partly obscured by a subsequent encrustation of bryozoans. The colony having been mostly weathered away. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fossildude19 Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 55 minutes ago, Rockwood said: Crinoid caylx that's been partly obscured by a subsequent encrustation of bryozoans. The colony having been mostly weathered away. Awfully large for a crinoid calyx, no? My first thought was bryozoan encrusted sponge. 1 Tim - VETERAN SHALE SPLITTER VFOTM --- APRIL - 2015 __________________________________________________ "In every walk with nature one receives far more than he seeks." John Muir ~ ~ ~ ~ ><))))( *> About Me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abyssunder Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 maybe something plant related? 1 " We are not separate and independent entities, but like links in a chain, and we could not by any means be what we are without those who went before us and showed us the way. " Thomas Mann My Library Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recker Posted December 12, 2018 Author Share Posted December 12, 2018 I appreciate all your help! It is a big fossil, I'm used to finding small horn coral and such saw this and was like holy snarge!! I can take more photos if that would help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockwood Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 1 hour ago, Fossildude19 said: Awfully large for a crinoid calyx, no? Big, but not too big. Notice the pentameral 'plates' that appear to underlie the overall geometry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recker Posted December 12, 2018 Author Share Posted December 12, 2018 Here is a close up photo of the outer layer or encrustation, if it helps. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
abyssunder Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 1 hour ago, Rockwood said: Notice the pentameral 'plates' that appear to underlie the overall geometry. Are you referring to these? 1 " We are not separate and independent entities, but like links in a chain, and we could not by any means be what we are without those who went before us and showed us the way. " Thomas Mann My Library Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockwood Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 40 minutes ago, abyssunder said: Are you referring to these? More so these. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herb Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 Maybe the cylindrical stromatolite Beatricea sp 1 "Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence"_ Carl Sagen No trees were killed in this posting......however, many innocent electrons were diverted from where they originally intended to go. " I think, therefore I collect fossils." _ Me "When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth."__S. Holmes "can't we all just get along?" Jack Nicholson from Mars Attacks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Echinoid Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 Maybe a concretion which formed around a coral or sponge? The outer layer appears to contain some small corals or foraminifera. This is very similar to some of the phosphate concretions found at Beaumaris: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doushantuo Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 phosphatized Thalassinoides burrow? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Tahan Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 I’m seeing what looks like a quartz vein surrounded by the host matrix......that’s if this is not a fossil. To be honest I don’t see anything that screams fossil right away. Could be a filled burrow?.....I do see some details running along the “inner” layer. The “outer” layer of this piece shows signs of “exfoliating” (super simplified: layered weathering) probably from a “competency contrast” between the 2 different “rock types”. Maybe a trace fossil? But I don’t see much more to indicate more than a trace fossil or a quartz vein. Try to see what formation it may have come from (if at all possible) and see if anything has been documented like this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Tahan Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 Just did a google search......Franklin county, Indiana has Ordovician age rocks. The oldest rocks are limestone dolostone and sandstone and are “subsurface” the youngest rocks shale and limestone and are probably what outcrop in that part of Indiana. Since this was along a river this could have been from another part of the state. If it did it could be Silurian or Devonian age as well as they also make up a large portion of southeast Indiana. At this his point I would try to see what fossils have been documented in the Devonian, Silurian, and Ordovician rocks of southeast Indiana. Im seeing a rocktype of a shaley, possibly limestone surrounding a “quartz like” vein. perhaps the “inner” later is calcite? May need to bust out the vinegar for more clues. Hope this helps you in the search for answers Al Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockwood Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 33 minutes ago, Al Tahan said: I’m seeing what looks like a quartz vein surrounded by the host matrix......that’s if this is not a fossil Not sure if it's what you intended to indicate, but just to be clear, fossils do sometimes have quartz veins running through them. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minnbuckeye Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 15 hours ago, Recker said: I hunt the Ordovician, so when something this large presents itself, I think "could it be a cephalopod". Some cephalopods locally will be hollow, some with quartz deposits. this exhibits both. The picture that interests me the most was the one quoted above. There are longitudinal ridges similar to the cephalopod Kionoceratids. Just a thought. It still doesn't explain the outer layer. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doushantuo Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 the image is from: CHRISTIAN KLUG, BJÖRN KRÖGER AND KENNETH DE BAETS An Early Devonian nonagonal orthoconic cephalopod from Morocco in: Tanabe, K., Shigeta, Y., Sasaki, T. & Hirano, H. (eds.) 2010. Cephalopods - Present and Past Tokai University Press, Tokyo, p. 141-146. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Tahan Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 11 minutes ago, minnbuckeye said: I hunt the Ordovician, so when something this large presents itself, I think "could it be a cephalopod". Some cephalopods locally will be hollow, some with quartz deposits. this exhibits both. The picture that interests me the most was the one quoted above. There are longitudinal ridges similar to the cephalopod Kionoceratids. Just a thought. It still doesn't explain the outer layer. Those lines running down do seem to have some connection to the photos there!! Maybe it’s just a large weathered cephalopod 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Tahan Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 31 minutes ago, Rockwood said: Not sure if it's what you intended to indicate, but just to be clear, fossils do sometimes have quartz veins running through them. I’ve seen quartz veins that are not fossils that have looked “similar”. I have also seen fossils with veins in them. If the fossilization was just from replacement by silica it could look like this too. Just trying to help. From the images @minnbuckeye shared I think its probably a large cephalopod remnant. Neat! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Tahan Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 The “outer” layer could just be the matrix around the “plausible” cephalopod. Tough to know for certain because it wasn’t in situ. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Tahan Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 One last thing I want to add it’s not really easy to make a 100% ID from this. I personally think it’s a geologic feature or unidentifiable fossil remnant. That’s all I can personally say. I’ll sit back and let others put in their thoughts now that I’ve blown up the thread 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockwood Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 This area sure looks biological. Do you suppose coenosteum of a heliolitid is out of the question ? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recker Posted December 13, 2018 Author Share Posted December 13, 2018 3 hours ago, Al Tahan said: Just did a google search......Franklin county, Indiana has Ordovician age rocks. The oldest rocks are limestone dolostone and sandstone and are “subsurface” the youngest rocks shale and limestone and are probably what outcrop in that part of Indiana. Since this was along a river this could have been from another part of the state. If it did it could be Silurian or Devonian age as well as they also make up a large portion of southeast Indiana. At this his point I would try to see what fossils have been documented in the Devonian, Silurian, and Ordovician rocks of southeast Indiana. Im seeing a rocktype of a shaley, possibly limestone surrounding a “quartz like” vein. perhaps the “inner” later is calcite? May need to bust out the vinegar for more clues. Hope this helps you in the search for answers Al I appreciate everyone's help in trying to id this! A little more background on the area and how, where I found it. The Brookville Reservoir was formed when they flooded a large area and built a dam to control flooding downriver where I live. The north end of the reservoir does extend almost to Richmond Indiana and into the Silurian age. Where I live is considered the Whitewater Valley and unlike most of Indiana that is flat we have higher elevations, many creeks that originate in the hills feed into the river as well. Even though the Whitewater is controlled by a dam it still is prone to flooding and in the fall they open the dam up for a draw down to prepare for winter snow and precipitation. When I found this object it was jammed behind some larger rocks and small brush that had bent down from the higher water. The location that I found it is New Trenton. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recker Posted December 13, 2018 Author Share Posted December 13, 2018 2 hours ago, Al Tahan said: Those lines running down do seem to have some connection to the photos there!! Maybe it’s just a large weathered cephalopod Wow, sure looks similar!! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recker Posted December 13, 2018 Author Share Posted December 13, 2018 This is a photo I took yesterday of the location I found the fossil, you can see the river does get pretty high and flows fast, the river had dropped enough for me to get out looking yesterday. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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