Some thoughts from a newbie dinosaur collector- dem bones

[fossilsonwheels]

For the most part I am pretty happy with our collection so far and pretty satisfied with the fossils for our presentation. I know we are lacking a couple of items that kids will really dig. I am working on picking up a low quality, cheap Tyrannosaur tooth that the kids can handle. I know that is something kids will LOVE. I am close to having a Jurassic sauropod bone so we will have something soon that represents the massive size of a dino. Beyond that, I know what I want to add but not the order. Most of the next round of purchases will be bone not teeth. Dromaeosaurid teeth are an exception but the next few additions really need to be bones.

 

Part of why kids dig dinosaurs so much is they were huge animals. Bones give a much better representation of that size than teeth do. I picked up on the basics of identifying dinosaur teeth pretty quickly but bones are a different. I am working on a basic anatomy lesson on dinosaurs for myself. I study for about a half a night as that is all the time I have right now. Feeling okay about basic dinosaur anatomy is a good thing but learning about the fossil bones as collectibles is pretty scary.

 

I see bones all over the place so I am not worried about finding them. It is EVERYTHING else about that worries me. Figuring out if they are even dinosaur bones is pretty hard for me at this point. I see bones that look to be chunkasaurus to me but are labeled with a species. I also see a lot of fragments that have not only have species but are labeled as ribs or verts or limb bones. Where are the ID"S coming from? How does anybody know that fragment is a Triceratops limb bone? To me it seems a clear cut case of dealers wanting a species to move product. I get why it occurs but it is not helpful.  For somebody new to this, it is pretty crazy to see so many bones with species attached. I avoid most of the bones I am seeing right now. I simply do not trust my knowledge and I do not trust a lot of what I see.

 

I have taken to assuming most of what I see is not identified correctly. I may not know a lot about dinosaur bones but it has to be snarge near impossible to ID a fragment of bone to species level or even family level. This makes it hard to trust peoples identifications when it comes to bones that are probably more diagnostic. I am doing my best to study my bones and I am putting in the time to really increase my knowledge. I have already learned not to rely on dealer ID's but the bones take time to learn. Each dinosaur is different so you have to know quite a bit. I made a list of the bones we want to add and I study those 5 or 6 which I find helpful. I avoid impulse buys and I am very cautious.

 

I will also use the forum more before I am ready to buy something. I plan on posting bones I see come up and get more informed opinions and developing resources. I have a few dealers that I do trust so that will help too. I think for the bones, developing connections and fostering relationships will be really helpful but I am still finding sources for fossils so my connections are limited.

 

My advice to my fellow newbies is go slow and learn as much as you can. Invest your in knowledge before you invest in the fossils. Be careful and get ID's verified before you buy. I wish you all luck in your collections and good luck with dem bones

 

[olorotitan]

I wish you the best on your endeavor to procure bones for your program.

 

I think location the bone is found in is the largest identifier to what type of fauna or set of clades an unknown fossil can be.  Without even looking at a fossil, a good location tag will do all of three things: dictate what types of animals can be collected in a specific area, give a general geologic age in which to derive an identification from, and a specific group of published scientific papers that can verify a particular species or genus designation (if lucky).  This is all without even having looked at a specimen.  This is why provenance is so important for fossils.

 

For me, one of the first things I look for in a bone identification is the presence and quality of articular surfaces in a bone.  They are so diagnostic that I will often not buy bones unless they have some form or clue to attachment to the skeleton.  Articulation surfaces will tell you what type of joint the bone was involved in, and this information can give you decent certainty (usually down to one or two choices) as to where it came from in the body, even without looking at or studying a complete bone specimen.  The main types of joint types I look out for are ball and socket, hinge, pivot, and plane joints.  These are mostly found in appendicular bones.  There are also fibrous joints and cartilaginous joints which are mostly found in axial bones. 

 

To close, I would suggest taking a human anatomy class in a community college where you can touch and feel different bones and learn to identify them.  The class I took has been indispensable in this hobby.  

[fossilsonwheels]

24 minutes ago, olorotitan said:

I wish you the best on your endeavor to procure bones for your program.

 

I think location the bone is found in is the largest identifier to what type of fauna or set of clades an unknown fossil can be.  Without even looking at a fossil, a good location tag will do all of three things: dictate what types of animals can be collected in a specific area, give a general geologic age in which to derive an identification from, and a specific group of published scientific papers that can verify a particular species or genus designation (if lucky).  This is all without even having looked at a specimen.  This is why provenance is so important for fossils.

 

For me, one of the first things I look for in a bone identification is the presence and quality of articular surfaces in a bone.  They are so diagnostic that I will often not buy bones unless they have some form or clue to attachment to the skeleton.  Articulation surfaces will tell you what type of joint the bone was involved in, and this information can give you decent certainty (usually down to one or two choices) as to where it came from in the body, even without looking at or studying a complete bone specimen.  The main types of joint types I look out for are ball and socket, hinge, pivot, and plane joints.  These are mostly found in appendicular bones.  There are also fibrous joints and cartilaginous joints which are mostly found in axial bones. 

 

To close, I would suggest taking a human anatomy class in a community college where you can touch and feel different bones and learn to identify them.  The class I took has been indispensable in this hobby.  

Thank you very much for the advice. I took human anatomy in college many years ago and have a biology background but a refresher is not a bad idea. I work for CSU school so I can get access to bones. The dinosaurs are difficult as so many of the ones I see are fragmentary. I appreciate the information you gave me. That is very helpful knowledge. 

[siteseer]

On 3/5/2019 at 8:05 AM, fossilsonwheels said:

Thank you very much for the advice. I took human anatomy in college many years ago and have a biology background but a refresher is not a bad idea. I work for CSU school so I can get access to bones. The dinosaurs are difficult as so many of the ones I see are fragmentary. I appreciate the information you gave me. That is very helpful knowledge. 

 

Yeah, you want to get an idea of what a whale vertebra or humerus looks like versus those of likely dinosaurs or mosasaurs you might run into.  There's a guy at a local flea market who is trying to sell "dinosaur" bones from Bakersfield.  I told him they were from whales but he insisted they're dinosaur even though dinosaur-age exposures are maybe at least 100 miles away (even then dinosaur bones are very rare there because it's a marine deposit).  The matrix is Sharktooth Hill Bonebed.  You can even smell it.

 

Jess