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Protoceratops fossils - are they rare?


Sauroniops

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So not too long ago, I acquired a Protoceratops tooth from a German fossil gallery. And I have been looking for more fossils of the species for comparison both in price-range and rarity, but cannot seem to find any other protoceratops fossils anywhere.

 

Does anyone know if these teeth are ever sold online? And have I perhaps made a heck of a buy? I'm not sure if the fossils from the Gobi Desert are rare or just hard to come by, unless you live in Asia. Any information would be appreciated, thanks!

 

(Will put up some pictures of the tooth when I get home later)

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They are very rare but not impossible to onbtain. I have seen two teeth for sale in the last decade. There is a skull and some leg bones for sale somewhere also, but I don't know how much of it is reconstructed.  Most of these fossils pop up with European dealers with pieces from old collections (before the ban).  You probably did a good and rare deal and I look forward to seeing the tooth.

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41 minutes ago, Sauroniops said:

So not too long ago, I acquired a Protoceratops tooth from a German fossil gallery. And I have been looking for more fossils of the species for comparison both in price-range and rarity, but cannot seem to find any other protoceratops fossils anywhere.

 

Does anyone know if these teeth are ever sold online? And have I perhaps made a heck of a buy? I'm not sure if the fossils from the Gobi Desert are rare or just hard to come by, unless you live in Asia. Any information would be appreciated, thanks!

 

(Will put up some pictures of the tooth when I get home later)

 

They are rare because it is illegal to export them from Mongolia.  :( 

 

It could also be a different species of basal ceratopsian. There are a number of them, and apparently they are fairly comparable looking.

See this topic.

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3 minutes ago, Fossildude19 said:

 

They are rare because it is illegal to export them from Mongolia.  :( 

 

It could also be a different species of basal ceratopsian. There are a number of them, and apparently they are fairly comparable looking.

See this topic.

I have looked at other pictures of protoceratops teeth (Not any for sale though), and it looks very similiar. They guy who owned the gallery also owns 4 full dinosaur skeletons, and all sorts of other stuff. I am gonna put up a picture of the tooth as soon as I get back :dinothumb:

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Couple if points..Rarity only from a commercial sense for the reasons stated.   Preban only apply to countries like China, Thailand and those from South America.  Mongolian fossil laws go back to around 1924 before commercial exporting existed like it is today.. 

 

In addition to photos, identification will require a specific locality and the formation where it was found.  Isolated dentary and maxillary teeth might be difficult to differentiate from other Ceratopsians like Bagaceratops which are very similar but differ in size

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@Troodon It is about 1,5 cm at its longest point. The little "fact-sheet" or paper that belonged with the fossil, only says it's from the Gobi Desert og Mongolia though, not any specific formation or district is given (I guess it would have to be the Djadochta Formation, if it is supposed to be from a Protoceratops). The collector I bought it from has his own shop/gallery, which includes several full skeletons of both dinosaurs, marine reptiles, amphibians and pterosaurs, where he's been digging up a bunch of them himself. I could probably try and contact him, but don't know if he'd remember this tooth, considering how big his collection is. He's been on digging-expeditions pretty much all over the world I think.

 

VekvjPB.jpg

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That tooth looks like the other ceratopsian teeth I've sold as Protoceratops from Mongolia. No idea if they truly are.

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Looking forward to meeting my fellow Singaporean collectors! Do PM me if you are a Singaporean, or an overseas fossil-collector coming here for a holiday!

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11 hours ago, -Andy- said:

That tooth looks like the other ceratopsian teeth I've sold as Protoceratops from Mongolia. No idea if they truly are.

Unfortunately this is a lot like what existed when teeth from Argentina were available when every theropod tooth sold was Carnotaurus from the Allen Formation, both incorrect but that sells.  Protoceratops is the best known popular ceratopsian so little is research is done to understand the morphology of other ceratopsian species or to pin down the real locality of where they were found.  Other Ceratopsians existed in the Campanian deposits of Mongolia both described and some indeterminate.  So isolated, worn teeth can be difficult to assign to a genus and the locality may be problematic 

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Just to re-iterate... Protoceratops is an incredibly common fossil in the  Cretaceous beds of Mongolia.  So, no it is not rare at all.  It is, however rare to find on the open market because of the long standing ban on exporting fossils from that country, and the actual respect for this law that exists inside and outside Mongolia (compare with China).   

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14 hours ago, jpc said:

Just to re-iterate... Protoceratops is an incredibly common fossil in the  Cretaceous beds of Mongolia.  So, no it is not rare at all.  It is, however rare to find on the open market because of the long standing ban on exporting fossils from that country, and the actual respect for this law that exists inside and outside Mongolia (compare with China).   

 

Do you have any clue which formation these teeth might have come from? I see them show up from time to time. The same size, color and preservation.

Looking forward to meeting my fellow Singaporean collectors! Do PM me if you are a Singaporean, or an overseas fossil-collector coming here for a holiday!

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@-Andy- Not at this point no. I've sent a mail to the collector I bought it from, about if he knows which district or formation it is from.

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5 hours ago, -Andy- said:

 

Do you have any clue which formation these teeth might have come from? I see them show up from time to time. The same size, color and preservation.

Well let me say it again one cannot assume what is being sold belongs to Protoceratops just because the seller is saying they are.  You have Bagaceratops which is also a Protoceratopsid in the Gobi Desert.   Again you cannot assume the localities provided are accurate so you cannot assign an ID just based on that..

 

Here is an paper that can give you some insights into protoceratopsid distribution.

 

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=http://palaeontologia.pan.pl/Archive/1975-33_133-181_36-50.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwiNx465oJPhAhUGJzQIHRFZB6wQFjACegQIBxAB&usg=AOvVaw1UvPrP9UW98-lFMoK88-kX

 

Then there the Leptoceratopids like Udanoceratops or the ceratopsian Yamaceratops whose teeth look a bit like worn Protoceratopsid teeth.  

1553172261402_Screenshot_2019-03-19-15-59-58.thumb.jpg.fb675f537e4424db3c1423893103cbcf.jpg

 

Makovicky, Peter J.; Norell, Mark A. (2006). "Yamaceratops dorngobiensis, a new primitive ceratopsian (Dinosauria: Ornithischia) from the Cretaceous of Mongolia"American Museum Novitates. 3530: 1–42. 

 

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  • 2 weeks later...

They are common dinosaur fossils in the Gobi Desert. There is a complete Protoceratops skull for sale on a website.

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