Turtle? Ray?

[FossilsAnonymous]

Hey all, found this today at our private site. Looks like a ray plastron? Never seen it before. We also found a nice gator tooth too.

[The Jersey Devil]

Looks like a turtle carapace piece.

[sixgill pete]

I agree with turtle. But i think it is part of the plastron. 

[Harry Pristis]

Resembles a neural, from the carapace.

 

 

 

 

[ClearLake]

While I am admittedly more familiar with modern turtle skeletons than Miocene ones, I have some questions about this being a carapace neural. The neurals are attached to the vertebra and at least in the ones I am familiar with, that attachment is more obvious than the potential bump on the one side of this piece.  Perhaps it is worn?  Perhaps I’m just not seeing it in the pictures provided.  Perhaps in this type of turtle, that is how it looks, I’m not sure but I would like to see an edge on picture to see the profile of this piece. Also, the edges don’t look like turtle bone and the rather intricate way the carapace pieces join together, but again, maybe this piece is eroded or “smoothed out” in the fossilization process.

 

I’ll agree the shape is very similar to a carapace neural, but there are just some other features that make me question that a bit.  I don’t have an alternate interpretation to suggest but I’m not that familiar with ray plates or other such things. 

[FossilsAnonymous]

@ClearLake very valid points. Here are a couple more pictures.

[ClearLake]

Thanks for the extra pictures. The profile also seems to fit with the other shape parameters for a turtle carapace neural, so I could live with that until I hear some better ID. I’d like to see a comparison with a known Miocene turtle to feel really good, but that’s just me. Thanks for showing the piece.  

[caterpillar]

Neural plate for sure

[sixgill pete]

On 7/2/2019 at 9:41 PM, Harry Pristis said:

Resembles a neural, from the carapace.

 

 

 

 

I stand corrected. Thanks Harry for the great illustration.