Possible skull?

[diginupbones]

I found this a while back and figured it was just a piece of pelvis or some other unidentifiable bone. Once I started cleaning it up I noticed what looked like a couple of teeth sticking out. I started cleaning out all the nooks and crannies and discovered that these holes passed all the way from one into the other and you could push a pipe cleaner all the way through them. I don’t know which way is up or down on this thing or what kind of animal it could’ve possibly come from. It is solid all the way through and heavy.  Found in North Central Nebraska. 
 @jpc

[johnnyvaldez7.jv]

@diginupbones I don't know what it is but I like it. I'm interested in knowing what others think it might be.

[Mahnmut]

Wow, thats definitely part of a skull.

I think what looks so eerily like eye sockets in some of the pics may have contained massive teeth/tusks.

So the channels you put the cleaners through could be part of a frontal sinus.

Very curious to hear what others think of this!

Best Regards,

J

 

[jpc]

This is the chin of some large mammal; fused dentaries.  The round cavities are the base of the alveoli for the teeth in front of the ones you have remnants of.  I am not too familiar with Miocene large mammals but this thing had some large front teeth.   

[Harry Pristis]

You can get the idea from this example:

 

[diginupbones]

Thanks guys! That is really helpful, I would have never guessed lower jaw. So now I am hoping that with the shape of the tooth sockets and the curve where the jaw  splits I can hopefully narrow it down. 

[diginupbones]

It looks like the most likely suspect is rhino (Teleoceras).  The large teeth in front are about the right distance apart. The sockets of the teeth behind those have the same figure 8 or peanut shaped as other rhino jaws I have found. They also angle towards the front of the jaw  like the ones in the photo. I have also found quite a few other rhino bones  in the area so everything seems to fit.  Thanks again for your help! 
 

[Shellseeker]

21 hours ago, diginupbones said:

It looks like the most likely suspect is rhino (Teleoceras).  The large teeth in front are about the right distance apart. The sockets of the teeth behind those have the same figure 8 or peanut shaped as other rhino jaws I have found. They also angle towards the front of the jaw  like the ones in the photo. I have also found quite a few other rhino bones  in the area so everything seems to fit.  Thanks again for your help! 

Congratulations on an interesting fossil.  I have found a few pieces of Rhino and with this fossil in hand, I think you might know or can figure out a few things, like:

1) Can you identify the teeth and positions (i.e lower right p3/p4 ).  2) It hard to determine size of teeth.  Please provide the measurements in words.

 

In your last photo, there are these intriguing round craters... Please measure them also.  I have something that might fit.

Thanks for providing the opportunity to post this photo AND filling out my knowledge on what the inside of the jaw looks like.

 

 

[Shellseeker]

I have been playing around with photos:

Note that one side of the Alveoli is flatter than the semicircle on the other side of the alveoli.  Same thing on the tusk.

One thing I think that I have learned is that I have a left Tusk. Not sure about that....  I am curious to find out

whether the proximal end of the Tusk "fits' in the circular root hole in the Jaw.

 

 

[diginupbones]

This piece is complete enough to tell that the tooth I have remnants of is definitely P3.  The only thing left of it is the two roots so it’s kind of hard to get a good measurement. L is about 29 mm and W is about 17 mm. The widest part of what’s left of the round socket is about 23 mm. Hope this helps.

[Shellseeker]

1 hour ago, diginupbones said:

This piece is complete enough to tell that the tooth I have remnants of is definitely P3.  The only thing left of it is the two roots so it’s kind of hard to get a good measurement. L is about 29 mm and W is about 17 mm. The widest part of what’s left of the round socket is about 23 mm. Hope this helps.

Thanks. I think if you measure to the outside of the broken roots,  it is a really good approximation of the size of the actual p3.

 

I do not believe that the proximal end of the Tusk_incisor is damaged in any way.  As you can see, a measurement of the longest Tusk Length is slightly less than 25 mm, which might mean that the jaw section comes from a smaller individual. In comparing this tusk, with similar ones available on the Internet, I have not seen one as large, implying to me that it came from an adult male. 

 

I am really pleased to see the "shape" of the alveoli.  Thanks

 

[Shellseeker]

I am still picking up information trying to get a good photo of a Teleoceras lower p3.

Found this PDF  at the Rhino Resource Center,

Hagge, M.D. 2010 A functional and ontogenetic skull analysis of the extant rhinoceroses and Teleoceras major, an extinct miocene North American rhinoceros. Ph.D. Thesis, Department of Geology and geophysics, Louisiana State University, pp. 1-173

 

  that had this table.  When I only have one species of Teleoceras and that species exists in no other state,  makes comparisons somewhat more questionable.