Per Christian Posted July 28, 2021 Share Posted July 28, 2021 Hi all, I've been offered these two teeth that I've been told are pliosaur teeth. They're from Morocco. They must have a fair amount of repairs due to the glued matrix and cracks etc, but do they look legitimate? The shape looks like pliosaur to me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anomotodon Posted July 28, 2021 Share Posted July 28, 2021 These teeth seem like they are from Akrabou formation in Goulmima, but you need to ask the seller for better pictures. Based on this pic, they look real, possibly a bit repaired but such teeth can also have natural cracks. There were two other groups of plesiosaurs in Akrabou - Polycotylids and Elasmosaurids, and to distinguish them from pliosaurs you need a clear view of crown morphology, especially enamel ornamentation. The Tooth Fairy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Per Christian Posted July 29, 2021 Author Share Posted July 29, 2021 8 hours ago, Anomotodon said: These teeth seem like they are from Akrabou formation in Goulmima, but you need to ask the seller for better pictures. Based on this pic, they look real, possibly a bit repaired but such teeth can also have natural cracks. There were two other groups of plesiosaurs in Akrabou - Polycotylids and Elasmosaurids, and to distinguish them from pliosaurs you need a clear view of crown morphology, especially enamel ornamentation. Thanks! I got these extra pictures, do they help? They're not the best pictures unfortunately Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anomotodon Posted July 29, 2021 Share Posted July 29, 2021 (edited) I don’t think either of these teeth are pliosaur. Strong labio-lingual compression, as in tooth 2, is usually typical of Elasmosaurids (Libonectes in this case) but it seems that enamel ornamentation is too coarse. Compression can also be caused by deformation after fossilization, so I would cautiously call this tooth a Polycotylid. Not sure about the first tooth, so Plesiosauria indet. Is it compressed at all? @pachy-pleuro-whatnot-odon what do you think? Edited July 29, 2021 by Anomotodon 1 The Tooth Fairy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Per Christian Posted July 29, 2021 Author Share Posted July 29, 2021 24 minutes ago, Anomotodon said: I don’t think either of these teeth are pliosaur. Strong labio-lingual compression, as in tooth 2, is usually typical of Elasmosaurids (Libonectes in this case) but it seems that enamel ornamentation is too coarse. Compression can also be caused by deformation after fossilization, so I would cautiously call this tooth a Polycotylid. Not sure about the first tooth, so Plesiosauria indet. Is it compressed at all? @pachy-pleuro-whatnot-odon what do you think? You show impressive knowledge, thanks so much for that feedback. I'm less interested in buying them now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pachy-pleuro-whatnot-odon Posted July 29, 2021 Share Posted July 29, 2021 Tim is spot on with his inference that these teeth come from Goulmima, a locality where, apart from the basal mosasauroid Tethysaurus nopscaivarious plesiosaurian species are known to have occurred. Amongst these are: Libonectes morgani, an elasmosaur Thililua longicollis, a polycotylid Manemergus anguirostris, a smaller polycotylid Cf. Brachauchenius lucasi, a pliosaur What you appear to have here are two polycotylid teeth, which lingually bear fine striae along the base of the crown, up until about halfway upon the crown. They're often somewhat compressed, but this is not due to plastic deformation, instead being part of the tooth morphology: elasmosaur teeth, though labiolingually compressed too, start from a conical base shape, these polycotylids are much more triangular in morphology. The ornamentation also clearly differs, with that on elasmosaurian teeth running the full apicobasal height of the tooth and causing being both finer and anastomosing, while these polycotylid teeth have straight vertical striae that, as said, do not span the full apicobasal height. Unfortunately, I haven't figured out yet how to distinguish Thililua from Manemergus teeth yet - except many be on size - as the potentially informative ornamentation on identifiable specimens is always obscured by skull-elements (that is, they're typically still in place in the skull). Lastly, pliosaurian teeth from Goulmima tend to have many thicker striations in a semi-continuous pattern around conical teeth. Have a look at the below thread for an overview of Moroccan plesiosaur teeth, with an emphasis on those found in Goulmima (the phosphates having only yielded one species of elasmosaur - Zarafasaura oceanis - and the teeth from Boujdour are, to my knowledge, not yet described): 1 1 'There's nothing like millions of years of really frustrating trial and error to give a species moral fibre and, in some cases, backbone' -- Terry Pratchett Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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