trinko Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 My wife bought me this fossil as a Fathers Day gift. I'm a physicist not a paleontologist so while I like having a little cabinet of curiosities, including a bit of mars, i have no competence in assessing the reality of the fossil.I was a bit concerned when the fossil came without any paper documentation, just an email to my wife.I'm also wondering because of the color; i realize that the color varies with the minerals but i personally haven't seen a fossil, as opposed to a matrix, this lightly colored.I queried the dealer and he said he got it from a UK dealer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trinko Posted June 22, 2016 Author Share Posted June 22, 2016 Seeing the picture posted my impression is that the real item is a bit whiter. The background is very white. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnJ Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 Do you have other photos? The human mind has the ability to believe anything is true. - JJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raggedy Man Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 I really can't help with the identification, but if someone can help if you google Dromaeosaurinae indent claw an image of this exact piece(different photo) is there. ...I'm back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trinko Posted June 22, 2016 Author Share Posted June 22, 2016 Do you have other photos? Yes. I'm new here however and I don't see a way to upload an image on my computer in a reply. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnJ Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 Use the More Reply Options at the lower right of the text box. The human mind has the ability to believe anything is true. - JJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trinko Posted June 22, 2016 Author Share Posted June 22, 2016 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trinko Posted June 22, 2016 Author Share Posted June 22, 2016 Thanks for any info Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ridgehiker Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 I've found quite a few and from the photo I'd say it isn't. However, not quite enough detail to be definitive. One needs to see the proximal surface to make a judgement. That's the surface of the claw towards the body ( opposite of tip). The way it attaches to the previous phalange is somewhat diagnostic. Re the colour. Yes, can be quite variable depending on a variety of variables from the minerals in the ground, heat, etc. As a physicist I'm sure you can think of all types of scenarios that could impact the density, colour and and subtle shape of a specimen over tens of millions of years. We get used to finding fossils in a particular formation and can overlook similar specimens in another. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troodon Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 From the color and collection of matrix glued at one end makes me think its Moroccan. They typically use matrix to hide breakages. The blood groove on your top photo gives me a concern that it's not a theropod or dinosaurian but really it's not clear enough on the photo to make that call. Can you take a straight on photo of both sides and not at an oblique angle that are sharper. What is the size of the claw? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raggedy Man Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 (edited) This might not be allowed, but I found the listing at fossil mall that gives it's provenance along with other images. http://www.fossilmall.com/fossils-for-sale/dinosaurs/dt2/dromaeosaur-dinosaur-claw-for-sale.htm Dromaeosaurinae indet Dinosaur Claw Dinosauria Suborder Theropoda, Family: Dromaeosauridae, Subfamily Dromaeosaurinaee Geological Time: Lower Cretaceous, Albian Stage (112 97 million years ago) Size (25.4 mm = 1 inch): 22 mm outside curve length, 9 mm base width Fossil Site: Kem-Kem Beds, Tegana Formation, South of Taouz, Morocco Edited June 22, 2016 by Raggedy Man ...I'm back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Troodon Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 (edited) Good job Raggedy Man thought it looked Moroccan With the new photos in my opinion the claw is not dinosaurian but some other reptile. The morphology of the claw just does not fit theropod. Edited June 22, 2016 by Troodon 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnJ Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 This might not be allowed, but I found the listing at fossil mall that gives it's provenance along with other images. http://www.fossilmall.com/fossils-for-sale/dinosaurs/dt2/dromaeosaur-dinosaur-claw-for-sale.htm Dromaeosaurinae indet Dinosaur Claw Dinosauria Suborder Theropoda, Family: Dromaeosauridae, Subfamily Dromaeosaurinaee Geological Time: Lower Cretaceous, Albian Stage (112 97 million years ago) Size (25.4 mm = 1 inch): 22 mm outside curve length, 9 mm base width Fossil Site: Kem-Kem Beds, Tegana Formation, South of Taouz, Morocco It's preferred that photos are uploaded to the Forum, without a link or mention of the dealer, since that info is not critical to an ID. On the other hand, any time I see 'matrix' glued to the diagnostic area of an otherwise clean 'fossil', it's a red flag for me. The human mind has the ability to believe anything is true. - JJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnBrewer Posted June 22, 2016 Share Posted June 22, 2016 Wish I got one of those for Fathers Day, looks really nice. Welcome to the forum John Map of UK fossil sites Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raggedy Man Posted June 23, 2016 Share Posted June 23, 2016 (edited) It's preferred that photos are uploaded to the Forum, without a link or mention of the dealer, since that info is not critical to an ID. On the other hand, any time I see 'matrix' glued to the diagnostic area of an otherwise clean 'fossil', it's a red flag for me. My apologies and I completely understand. I'll exercise better judgment in the future. Edited June 23, 2016 by Raggedy Man ...I'm back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnJ Posted June 23, 2016 Share Posted June 23, 2016 My apologies and I completely understand. I'll exercise better judgment in the future. No worries, Paul. My comment was more for general consumption. The human mind has the ability to believe anything is true. - JJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trinko Posted June 23, 2016 Author Share Posted June 23, 2016 In trying to get a picture of the end I was gently pressing down on the item to stabilize it for a shot of the end with the matrix when it broke. the first photo is the broken end of the long piece, the second shot is the intact piece directly from the side and the third photo is the broken end of the short piece.Thanks for your help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnJ Posted June 23, 2016 Share Posted June 23, 2016 Hi 'trinko', please, there is no need to mention the dealer's name. It has been removed from your post. Your photos will provide the best evidence for an ID. Thank you. The human mind has the ability to believe anything is true. - JJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trinko Posted June 23, 2016 Author Share Posted June 23, 2016 (edited) Hi 'trinko', please, there is no need to mention the dealer's name. It has been removed from your post. Your photos will provide the best evidence for an ID. Thank you. Why was the dealers name removed? He's actually not the dealer he's the guy the dealer said he got the fossil from. Why is it wrong to see if people have opinions on his reliability? The guy I bought the fossil from invoked the original dealers authority to verify the fossil so knowing if the original dealers reputation is good or bad would seem to be germane. Given that I, actually my wife but what's mine is hers, may have been ripped off, intentionally or otherwise, for a not trivial amount of money based on the comment of Trodden I am trying to see if I have any recourse. Therefore knowing if the dealer has a historical credibility problem is significant. Edited June 23, 2016 by trinko Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnJ Posted June 23, 2016 Share Posted June 23, 2016 The reputation of a particular person that the item came from does not make the fossil "real", or not. Specimens are identified by their distinguishing characteristics and the geology of their origin. Errors by dealers and professionals can / do occur. For those reasons, the problems of making identifications from photos, and frivolous legal issues, TFF chooses to not publish those names. The human mind has the ability to believe anything is true. - JJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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