Fossiljones Posted February 25, 2017 Share Posted February 25, 2017 Hi All, Had a great trip to South Carolina for river diving last weekend. The water was cold, and we had to dry-suit it, but nonetheless, everyone made some incredible finds, and had a great time. I've got three items I'm looking for the forum's expertise and wisdom on. 1. The first six pics are of what I believe to be a Camel Metacarpal, or Metatarsal. It looks to be in very pristine condition, so much so, that when I first found it, I assumed it must be modern and almost didn't bring it up. After returning home and investigating, I learned that it may be Camel, and I was very happily surprised. This just confirms the advice given to me many years ago by a wise veteran: when on the bottom of the river, and your not sure what something is, bag it up. Once back on the boat, you can always throw it back if it's nothing of interest. 2, The next four pics are of four articulated verts in matrix. I have no idea what these are from, they look fishy to me. The matrix is fairly soft. I can remove it with nothing more than a dental pick, and smooth it with a scrubbing pad and water. I intend to remove more of the matrix, but I want to leave enough to keep the articulation stable. 3. The last item appears to be a claw core? ( or a tusk from the newly discovered (by me) very very tiny, miniature Mammoth?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fruitbat Posted February 25, 2017 Share Posted February 25, 2017 I agree with your diagnosis of camelid metapodial for the first specimen. Is there any way you can get a closer shot of the broken end of the Micromammuthus fossiljonesi () specimen? I can't tell if there are Hunter-Schreger lines present or not. -Joe Illigitimati non carborundum Fruitbat's PDF Library Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fifbrindacier Posted February 25, 2017 Share Posted February 25, 2017 I agree the vertebrae can be fishy. Really nice finds. "On ne voit bien que par le coeur, l'essentiel est invisible pour les yeux." (Antoine de Saint-Exupéry) "We only well see with the heart, the essential is invisible for the eyes." In memory of Doren Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Pristis Posted February 25, 2017 Share Posted February 25, 2017 Good find! Looks like a metatarsal, not a metacarpal. For comparison: 1 http://pristis.wix.com/the-demijohn-page What seest thou else In the dark backward and abysm of time? ---Shakespeare, The Tempest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockwood Posted February 25, 2017 Share Posted February 25, 2017 Any chance the verts are some kind of amphibian ? They look a bit like one that was IDed as a salamander a while ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boesse Posted February 26, 2017 Share Posted February 26, 2017 Those are definitely teleost vertebrae - I had an ID for these a while back but can't seem to recall what the critter is. We've got some of this same taxon from the Oligocene Ashley/Chandler Bridge Formations in CCNHM collections. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor Mud Posted February 26, 2017 Share Posted February 26, 2017 I wonder if your matrix containing the fish verts would contain foraminifera? Often river finds are out of context and it's great to get some matrix. Forams may help to date your find. I would keep some matrix. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ropterus Posted February 26, 2017 Share Posted February 26, 2017 Wow! Nice finds! Congrats! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fossiljones Posted February 26, 2017 Author Share Posted February 26, 2017 Harry: thanks for the confirmation on the Metacarpal. Doctor Mud: Good idea, will do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Pristis Posted February 27, 2017 Share Posted February 27, 2017 I'm sorry, Fossiljones, the bone is a camel metatarsal, not a metacarpal. I've edited my original ID. http://pristis.wix.com/the-demijohn-page What seest thou else In the dark backward and abysm of time? ---Shakespeare, The Tempest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fossiljones Posted February 27, 2017 Author Share Posted February 27, 2017 Harry, thank you very much! I had used previous posts of yours to initially ID this find, and found myself going back and forth between Metacarpal and Metatarsal, because in the details I see characteristics from both. I'm glad to see your conclusion. We had many good finds during this trip, and I'm thinking for the first time of submitting a trip report. Most of our finds do not require ID help because they're instantly recognizable, but it was such a unique trip, I think it would make an interesting story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ynot Posted February 27, 2017 Share Posted February 27, 2017 18 minutes ago, Fossiljones said: , but it was such a unique trip, I think it would make an interesting story. Darwin said: " Man sprang from monkeys." Will Rogers said: " Some of them didn't spring far enough." My Fossil collection - My Mineral collection My favorite thread on TFF. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Pristis Posted February 27, 2017 Share Posted February 27, 2017 18 hours ago, Fossiljones said: Harry, thank you very much! I had used previous posts of yours to initially ID this find, and found myself going back and forth between Metacarpal and Metatarsal, because in the details I see characteristics from both. I'm glad to see your conclusion. We had many good finds during this trip, and I'm thinking for the first time of submitting a trip report. Most of our finds do not require ID help because they're instantly recognizable, but it was such a unique trip, I think it would make an interesting story. Please do give us a trip report. Here are some line drawings to help (me) distinguish between metacarpal and metatarsal. There are a number of camels with metapodials of differing size, so I have not included an approximation of length. The morphology of the bones of these other camels will be similar for gross identification purposes. The proportions of the proximal and distal measurements may also be similar. The measurements I added are likely to be from Paleolama mirifica, the most common Pleistocene camelid in Florida. http://pristis.wix.com/the-demijohn-page What seest thou else In the dark backward and abysm of time? ---Shakespeare, The Tempest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fossilized6s Posted February 28, 2017 Share Posted February 28, 2017 Nice finds! I'm really loving those associated fish verts! ~Charlie~ "There are those that look at things the way they are, and ask why.....i dream of things that never were, and ask why not?" ~RFK ->Get your Mosasaur print ->How to spot a fake Trilobite ->How to identify a CONCRETION from a DINOSAUR EGG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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