Helicoprion Posted May 18, 2022 Share Posted May 18, 2022 Can anyone identify this Paleozoic marine invertebrate fossil in my collection? I know some of you might say the whole rock is a piece of fossilized coral but I don't think the entire rock is a fossil. I believe the pores might be invertebrate burrows but I'm not certain. I purchased it at a fossil convention so the context is lost. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lone Hunter Posted May 18, 2022 Share Posted May 18, 2022 I really can't make out anything, could you try to get clearer pictures? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Helicoprion Posted May 19, 2022 Author Share Posted May 19, 2022 21 hours ago, Lone Hunter said: I really can't make out anything, could you try to get clearer pictures? These are about the highest quality photos I've been able to take. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Kmiecik Posted May 19, 2022 Share Posted May 19, 2022 Not a matter of quality -- it's a matter of focus. Back the camera away from the specimen an inch or two and they'll be in focus. We can enlarge them if we need more detail. As it is they are just too fuzzy to make out any detail at all, and on a fragment, which this appears to be, detail is critical. Mark. Fossil hunting is easy -- they don't run away when you shoot at them! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Helicoprion Posted May 20, 2022 Author Share Posted May 20, 2022 On 5/18/2022 at 6:34 PM, Lone Hunter said: I really can't make out anything, could you try to get clearer pictures? Is this any better? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lone Hunter Posted May 20, 2022 Share Posted May 20, 2022 It's a little better, needs more light, don't give up! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fossildude19 Posted May 20, 2022 Share Posted May 20, 2022 Try taking your pictures in natural light - near a window or outside. Take a number of pictures from different distances away from the item. Post the ones that look the sharpest. Tim - VETERAN SHALE SPLITTER VFOTM --- APRIL - 2015 __________________________________________________ "In every walk with nature one receives far more than he seeks." John Muir ~ ~ ~ ~ ><))))( *> About Me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Helicoprion Posted May 21, 2022 Author Share Posted May 21, 2022 On 5/19/2022 at 8:58 PM, Fossildude19 said: Try taking your pictures in natural light - near a window or outside. Take a number of pictures from different distances away from the item. Post the ones that look the sharpest. What about this? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Helicoprion Posted May 21, 2022 Author Share Posted May 21, 2022 On 5/19/2022 at 8:58 PM, Fossildude19 said: Try taking your pictures in natural light - near a window or outside. Take a number of pictures from different distances away from the item. Post the ones that look the sharpest. What about this? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fossildude19 Posted May 21, 2022 Share Posted May 21, 2022 Better pictures. Unfortunately, I do not see any indication of fossils here. Tim - VETERAN SHALE SPLITTER VFOTM --- APRIL - 2015 __________________________________________________ "In every walk with nature one receives far more than he seeks." John Muir ~ ~ ~ ~ ><))))( *> About Me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mahnmut Posted May 21, 2022 Share Posted May 21, 2022 Much better foto. To me it does not look as if the whole piece was a fossil. That said, under the assumption that there once was a reason to buy this piece, take a close look under a magnifying glass and take fotos like the last one of whatever stands out. I think on the corner directly on your thumb there may perhaps be some kind of shell? Best Regards, J Try to learn something about everything and everything about something Thomas Henry Huxley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Top Trilo Posted May 21, 2022 Share Posted May 21, 2022 I see what may be trilobite parts, like a thorax in the second photo and cephalon and part of the thorax in the third. However that's probably just trilobite pareidolia. “If fossils are not "boggling" your mind then you are simply not doing it right” -Ken (digit) "No fossil is garbage, it´s just not completely preserved” -Franz (FranzBernhard) "With hammer in hand, the open horizon of time, and dear friends by my side, what can we not accomplish together?" -Kane (Kane) "We are in a way conquering time, reuniting members of a long lost family" -Quincy (Opabinia Blues) "I loved reading the trip reports, I loved the sharing, I loved the educational aspect, I loved the humor. It felt like home. It still does" -Mike (Pagurus) “The best deal I ever got was getting accepted as a member on The Fossil Forum. Not only got an invaluable pool of knowledge, but gained a loving family as well.” -Doren (caldigger) "it really is nice, to visit the oasis that is TFF" -Tim (fossildude19) "Life's Good! -Adam (Tidgy's Dad) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Helicoprion Posted May 21, 2022 Author Share Posted May 21, 2022 3 hours ago, Fossildude19 said: Better pictures. Unfortunately, I do not see any indication of fossils here. 2 hours ago, Top Trilo said: I see what may be trilobite parts, like a thorax in the second photo and cephalon and part of the thorax in the third. However that's probably just trilobite pareidolia. On 5/19/2022 at 8:55 PM, Lone Hunter said: It's a little better, needs more light, don't give up! I seem to remember the person I purchased them from either saying that the pores were crinoid burrows or that they were blastoid burrows. Are any of you familiar with the burrows produced by either animal? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lone Hunter Posted May 22, 2022 Share Posted May 22, 2022 There's a big difference between a pore and a burrow, I have never heard of crinoid burrows and unfortunately I still can't make out anything that looks like a burrow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Helicoprion Posted May 22, 2022 Author Share Posted May 22, 2022 44 minutes ago, Lone Hunter said: There's a big difference between a pore and a burrow, I have never heard of crinoid burrows and unfortunately I still can't make out anything that looks like a burrow. When I say burrows, I mean the depressions in the sand produced by the attachment of the crinoids to the seafloor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lone Hunter Posted May 22, 2022 Share Posted May 22, 2022 Maybe your thinking about crinoid holdfast but the picture isn't clear enough to see anything definitive, that's all I can think of since I haven't heard of a crinoid trace fossil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockwood Posted May 22, 2022 Share Posted May 22, 2022 This might be crinoid related. If so they were not exactly burrowing, but more being buried as disarticulated pieces. It looks like crinoid mush to me. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Helicoprion Posted May 22, 2022 Author Share Posted May 22, 2022 6 hours ago, Rockwood said: This might be crinoid related. If so they were not exactly burrowing, but more being buried as disarticulated pieces. It looks like crinoid mush to me. Is this "crinoid mush" something you have seen/heard of before? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kane Posted May 22, 2022 Share Posted May 22, 2022 27 minutes ago, Helicoprion said: Is this "crinoid mush" something you have seen/heard of before? The common term is "hash plate," and crinoid hash plates are by far more common than complete crinoids in most deposits on account of marine turbulence, or any other endemic forces that result in disarticulation. 1 ...How to Philosophize with a Hammer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fossildude19 Posted May 22, 2022 Share Posted May 22, 2022 Not seeing anything definitively crinoid related in the piece. 2 Tim - VETERAN SHALE SPLITTER VFOTM --- APRIL - 2015 __________________________________________________ "In every walk with nature one receives far more than he seeks." John Muir ~ ~ ~ ~ ><))))( *> About Me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockwood Posted May 22, 2022 Share Posted May 22, 2022 1 hour ago, Kane said: The common term is "hash plate," and crinoid hash plates are by far more common than complete crinoids in most deposits on account of marine turbulence, or any other endemic forces that result in disarticulation. Common maybe, but this will never be seen as an example. The shapes and textures strongly suggest it to me. Hash after a toddler plays with it a while. Mush. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Helicoprion Posted September 6, 2022 Author Share Posted September 6, 2022 On 5/22/2022 at 11:27 AM, Kane said: The common term is "hash plate," and crinoid hash plates are by far more common than complete crinoids in most deposits on account of marine turbulence, or any other endemic forces that result in disarticulation. On 5/22/2022 at 12:50 PM, Rockwood said: Common maybe, but this will never be seen as an example. The shapes and textures strongly suggest it to me. Hash after a toddler plays with it a while. Mush. Are there any discernable features of this specimen that can be used to determine whether it is crinoid hash or blastoid hash? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DPS Ammonite Posted September 6, 2022 Share Posted September 6, 2022 (edited) Columnals are a major portion of hash. Crinoid and blastoid columnals are difficult to tell apart. Here is a reference that says so: https://www.csus.edu/indiv/k/kusnickj/geology105/ech.html Edited September 6, 2022 by DPS Ammonite My goal is to leave no stone or fossil unturned. See my Arizona Paleontology Guide link The best single resource for Arizona paleontology anywhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rockwood Posted September 6, 2022 Share Posted September 6, 2022 2 hours ago, Helicoprion said: Are there any discernable features of this specimen that can be used to determine whether it is crinoid hash or blastoid hash? Beyond a look resembling the texture of crinoid material I see none. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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