Saurichthys eating a coelacanth?

[Crazyhen]

Here is a skull of Saurichthys from Yunnan, China with its mouth wide open, you can see there is a small fish at its mouth, look like the Saurichthys was eating the small fish.  The small fish, half embedded in matrix, looks like a coelacanth by its tail, any idea if it is a coelacanth or a Gymnoichthys inopinatus?

[Fossildude19]

Looks more like a coelacanth, to me.  The head is upside down on the Sauricthys.

 

Cropped, Colors reversed, contrast enhanced, and rotated:

 

 

 

[Mark Kmiecik]

Dead fish lying on the bottom of the water body, waiting to become fossilized don't eat anything. It's more likely that the smaller fish died and sank to the bottom where the larger specimen was lying and just happened to land in its open mouth. If it was inside the other's rib cage I might consider that it had been or was being eaten, and even then currents may have simply washed it into whatever cavity was nearby.

[hadrosauridae]

5 hours ago, Mark Kmiecik said:

Dead fish lying on the bottom of the water body, waiting to become fossilized don't eat anything. It's more likely that the smaller fish died and sank to the bottom where the larger specimen was lying and just happened to land in its open mouth. If it was inside the other's rib cage I might consider that it had been or was being eaten, and even then currents may have simply washed it into whatever cavity was nearby.

 

No, its very possible for it to be the fossilized remains its last attempted meal.  They are routinely found in the Green river formation fish fossils.  Called "aspirations" because the eater likely tried to swallow something too big, became lodged in the throat, and then died because it "choked" to death.  

[Mark Kmiecik]

14 hours ago, hadrosauridae said:

No, its very possible for it to be the fossilized remains its last attempted meal.  They are routinely found in the Green river formation fish fossils.  Called "aspirations" because the eater likely tried to swallow something too big, became lodged in the throat, and then died because it "choked" to death.  

Which is obviously not what happened here. The predator is about 20 times the size of its prey and would have no problems swallowing such a small "tidbit". Fish can't choke to death. They don't have lungs or an airway that can be blocked. "Aspiration" could only be caused by the predator attempting to eat something close to or larger than its own size. If the prey doesn't block the gills or the predator's ability to pass oxygenated water through the gills then the prey will eventually be consumed and digested. I have done a lot of fishing and caught fish that have had the tail of their previous meal, 3/4 of their own size, still sticking out of its mouth as it got hooked trying to eat the lure I was casting. I have witnessed that and similar incidents hundreds of times. Fish trying to eat something that is too big to eat is something that very rarely happens. I've only witnessed one case of this happening, and I fished a LOT. Three to five or more times per week for close to 50 years.

 

 

 

Edited October 11, 2022 by Mark Kmiecik
fix typo

[hadrosauridae]

15 hours ago, Mark Kmiecik said:

Which is obviously not what happened here. The predator is about 20 times the size of its prey and would have no problems swallowing such a small "tidbit". Fish can't choke to death. They don't have lungs or an airway that can be blocked. "Aspiration" could only be caused by the predator attempting to eat something close to or larger than its own size. If the prey doesn't block the gills or the predator's ability to pass oxygenated water through the gills then the prey will eventually be consumed and digested. I have done a lot of fishing and caught fish that have had the tail of their previous meal, 3/4 of their own size, still sticking out of its mouth as it got hooked trying to eat the lure I was casting. I have witnessed that and similar incidents hundreds of times. Fish trying to eat something that is too big to eat is something that very rarely happens. I've only witnessed one case of this happening, and I fished a LOT. Three to five or more times per week for close to 50 years.

 

 

 

 

 

Wrong.  Fish do "choke".  when the mouth is blocked, they cant pass water through the mouth and out over the gills.  They the "choke" because they cant adequately oxygenate their blood.   Whether or not this happened in this case, dont know.  But to say that it can't happen is 100% false.  As I stated earlier, the fossil evidence of it is common.

[Fossildude19]

Fossil Fish Aspiration images.

[JohnJ]

19 hours ago, Mark Kmiecik said:

If the prey doesn't block the gills or the predator's ability to pass oxygenated water through the gills then the prey will eventually be consumed and digested.

 

3 hours ago, hadrosauridae said:

Wrong.  Fish do "choke".  when the mouth is blocked, they cant pass water through the mouth and out over the gills.

 

Breathe in....

 

I think there is no disagreement regarding aspiration.

 

...and exhale.