digit Posted June 6, 2014 Share Posted June 6, 2014 Been having fun picking through my small cache of collected micro-matrix. So far I've found mostly tiny versions of the larger teeth I usually find and some pharyngeal "button" teeth from drums and other fishes. Been looking for the elusive cookie cutter shark tooth but haven't come across one yet. Turned up this in my searching today and I'm thinking this which looks a bit different from the normal micro fossils I've uncovered. I'm assuming it is likely some sort of ray tooth but I'm just learning about these little guys that usually fall through my sifting screen. The scale is in millimeters so it's a little one. Cheers. -Ken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old bones Posted June 6, 2014 Share Posted June 6, 2014 Hi Ken. That is an interesting one... Which matrix did you find it in? Are you working jcbshark's matrix? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fossilized6s Posted June 6, 2014 Share Posted June 6, 2014 It looks like a species of Stingray. Your pics are a bit dark sir. ~Charlie~ "There are those that look at things the way they are, and ask why.....i dream of things that never were, and ask why not?" ~RFK ->Get your Mosasaur print ->How to spot a fake Trilobite ->How to identify a CONCRETION from a DINOSAUR EGG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auspex Posted June 6, 2014 Share Posted June 6, 2014 Is it a tooth, or a denticle? "There has been an alarming increase in the number of things I know nothing about." - Ashleigh Ellwood Brilliant “Try to learn something about everything and everything about something.” - Thomas Henry Huxley >Paleontology is an evolving science. >May your wonders never cease! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digit Posted June 6, 2014 Author Share Posted June 6, 2014 To answer all questions: 1) It's not the famous jcbshark matrix (literally) known world wide by now. I collected this matrix from a gravel bar that I've known to produce lots of small shark teeth (just big enough to get caught by my 1/4" mesh). I figured if it had copious amounts of tiny teeth that it should be loaded with micro teeth. So far quite a few in the couple of millimeter range (posted elsewhere on this forum). Still looking for a cookie cutter tooth (or even a nice nurse shark tooth as a warm-up to that event). 2) Charlie, seemed kinda ray like to me but I'm quite the noob when it comes to micro-matrix (have only sorted a few cups of it). I need to get a better photo setup for the really tiny stuff as I'm taking low quality shots with a point-and-shoot set on "super macro" mode. No strobe at this distance so it is lit with a small LED flashlight and then brightened a bit in Photoshop. I tried going a bit more bright but the image quality seemed to deteriorate. Need to get me a good macro lens for my DSLR and a ring flash--maybe I'll treat myself to more photo equipment. TIP OF THE DAY: It pays to marry an understanding wife. 3) I couldn't conclusively say if it was tooth or dermal denticle (given that shark teeth are really just modified body scales--as you well know--there is a strong similarity). I might have to go do an image search for shark denticles to see if I can find something that looks like it matches. Kinda cool to see something different appear in my loupe while scanning bits of micro gravel. -Ken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sélacien34 Posted June 6, 2014 Share Posted June 6, 2014 I haven't found any specie with this type of tooth at this time, i think about dermal denticle. I can be wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digit Posted June 6, 2014 Author Share Posted June 6, 2014 Auspex might be right on this hunch. Thanks for the input Sélacien34. I haven't been able to find denticles that look exactly like this (most denticles seem to have scalloped grooves on their outer surface--great for minimizing turbulence minimizing hydrodynamic drag). Will continue to research images online and strive to get a better photo setup to get clearer photos. -Ken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Dente Posted June 6, 2014 Share Posted June 6, 2014 I'm pretty sure it isn't a shark or ray tooth. I have no guess as to what it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sélacien34 Posted June 6, 2014 Share Posted June 6, 2014 Could it be something like a part of denticle like that ? Just a guess. I'm looking for a good form... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digit Posted June 6, 2014 Author Share Posted June 6, 2014 Sounds like opinion is trending toward denticle. At 2x2 mm it is likely in the range for one. It does seem to share some of the features of that thresher denticle--woudn't that be a hoot! -Ken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sélacien34 Posted June 6, 2014 Share Posted June 6, 2014 (edited) Look at the number of different forms for just one specie, the denticles are not the same according to their place on the body of a chondrichthyian. I believe there is a big work to find the right owner. Edited June 6, 2014 by Sélacien34 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coco Posted June 6, 2014 Share Posted June 6, 2014 Centrophorus squamosus (recent species) Centroscymnus coelolepis (recent species) Galeorhinus galeus (recent species) Mustelus asterias (recent species) Coco ---------------------- OUTIL POUR MESURER VOS FOSSILES : ici Ma bibliothèque PDF 1 (Poissons et sélaciens récents & fossiles) : ici Ma bibliothèque PDF 2 (Animaux vivants - sans poissons ni sélaciens) : ici Mâchoires sélaciennes récentes : ici Hétérodontiques et sélaciens : ici Oeufs sélaciens récents : ici Otolithes de poissons récents ! ici Un Greg... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fossilized6s Posted June 6, 2014 Share Posted June 6, 2014 Look at the number of different forms for just one specie, the denticles are not the same according to their place on the body of a chondrichthyian. I believe there is a big job to find the right owner. Daenia calcea dermal denticles.PNG Nice find to help with the ID. I was going to suggest denticle, but.....well i fail. Haha ~Charlie~ "There are those that look at things the way they are, and ask why.....i dream of things that never were, and ask why not?" ~RFK ->Get your Mosasaur print ->How to spot a fake Trilobite ->How to identify a CONCRETION from a DINOSAUR EGG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sélacien34 Posted June 6, 2014 Share Posted June 6, 2014 (edited) Identified as chondrichthyian dermal denticle, which is something Edited June 6, 2014 by Sélacien34 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digit Posted June 6, 2014 Author Share Posted June 6, 2014 I think I'll go with that as an identification for now with the realization that identification to species would be likely impossible. Pretty chuffed about finding something I haven't found before--always makes my day. Thanks for all the help everyone. Cheers. -Ken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcbshark Posted June 7, 2014 Share Posted June 7, 2014 Hey Ken, I'd be happy to give you some matrix next time we meet up if you'd like. I don't know a lot about the micros but can tell you that the stuff I collect isn't reworked like the stuff I've seen in the Peace and that could contribute to the lack of cookie cutters in there. They are paper thin and very delicate. If you make it over here I'd be more than happy to take you and Tammy out there and you can collect some for yourself. Marco said he's never seen the density in cookie cutters in any other matrix he's searched and he's definitely seen his share lol. From what I've gathered from people who search them it seems like there's about one per lb. You know what I find funny, I only looked thru the micro stuff because a friend told me you could find cookie cutters in this creek and since I didn't have any I wanted at least one for my collection. I found about a dozen, not knowing they were somewhat rare and only found one nurse shark tooth which I figured were the rare ones lol. I've given away a fair share of the ones I found to those who I traded matrix for if they wanted one but have thought about getting them to sell to some of the fossil sites that deal in them, Surprisingly enough they actually fetch a good price and since I'm not really interested in them I thought maybe I could appease the better half and "sell" some of the stuff I find lol. Every once in a great while it's not just a big rock down there! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digit Posted June 7, 2014 Author Share Posted June 7, 2014 Jeff, I'll take you up on that offer when I'm back from Chicago. Just landed at Midway and I'm up way too early tomorrow to go meet a group from TFF digging for Mazon Creek nodules. Talk with you soon. -Ken Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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