Camelops?

[ChasG]

I believe this is an Ulna from a North American Camel. Picked it up in the Brazos earlier this month before the river rose 34'.

I have added a side by side of a horse Ulna to show the size differential. I have not completely eliminated the possibility that it is really big horse.

What are your thoughts? Camel? Big horse? other?

Thanks for the input.

[JohnJ]

These are distal humeri.

[ChasG]

thanks. Yes, you are obviously correct. Any help with the ID?

[jpevahouse]

Camelops was one of the largest Pleistocene camels and it's remains are documented to have been found in Texas. I have early horse molars from the Brazos river and they vary in size due to the diversity of early species. There were full size horses and small three toed varieties.

The humerus can be such a generic bone even if it were complete identification of it's species might inspire hot debate on the forum. It's always nice to find teeth for that reason, they have a better chance of more definitive identification.

[ChasG]

J,

Thanks for the reply. I found this very good video on youtube which outlines the differences between horse, ox and camel (too bad it is a bit grainy).

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Even though the video is only one date point, his point on the "Olecrani Fossa" being wider and less shallow on the camel versus the horse pushes me towards the camel camp on this one. I don't know if you can see from the pics, but the angle for the horse is about 30 degrees for about 2 centimeters and then angles towards 90 degrees -- hence a narrowing. The "suspect camel" starts of about 45 degrees and continues at a shallower angle until the break.

And the "Sulcus N. Radialis" is also nearly non existent in comparison which is again consistent with the video.

If the gentleman in the video is accurate in his descriptions, then my thought is that it is a camel.

Any additional thoughts?

[garyc]

Looks like you've found some compelling evidence. I have a few pieces of camelops from the Brazos...a tooth, a phalanx and possibly a femoral head.

[ChasG]

garyc,

I think it is pretty funny that this video even exists. I am guessing this was probably a grad student's project he posted on YouTube.

I have so many little broken pieces of unidentifiable items but this item is probably the best piece I have found. I found it in an area of exposed bedrock (which is rare for the southern Brazos) at the water line and it was wedged in there. My guess is that the way it was jammed between the rocks on the leeward side protected it.

The other bit of evidence on this piece I was hoping to track down to confirm it is a camelop is to determine the approximate size of what would be considered a large horse humerus. People I showed the horse humerus (pictured above) thought it was a fairly large humerus to begin with. The suspected camelop piece is 25% larger, thus it would be a giant horse or, most likely, a camelop.

If anyone has any data on bone size variance of a horse, it would be helpful. Google has cannon bone data but not humerus.

As always, thanks for the help.