ischua Posted August 12, 2016 Share Posted August 12, 2016 As I leaving work tonight I spied a small rock with small round somethings on it. Each round has hole thru the center surrounded by four more holes around the OD are four holes in line with the other four. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ischua Posted August 12, 2016 Author Share Posted August 12, 2016 Largest one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CraigHyatt Posted August 12, 2016 Share Posted August 12, 2016 I think crinoid is a good guess, but see what others say. Info: Craig Hyatt, retired software/electrical engineer Experience: Beginner, fossil hunting less than a year Location: Eagle Pass, TX USA on the border with Mexico, hot dry desert Formation: Escondido, Marine, Upper Cretaceous Materials: Sandstone, Mudstone, Shale, Chert, Chalk Typical: Thalassinoides, Sphenodiscus, Exogyra, Inoceramus Reference: http://txfossils.com/Txfossils.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ischua Posted August 12, 2016 Author Share Posted August 12, 2016 I have no clue as to age as this is parking lot gravel so some place in New York. The rock is about 1 inch around 3/8 thick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fossildude19 Posted August 12, 2016 Share Posted August 12, 2016 Crinoid, for sure. Regards, 1 Tim - VETERAN SHALE SPLITTER VFOTM --- APRIL - 2015 __________________________________________________ "In every walk with nature one receives far more than he seeks." John Muir ~ ~ ~ ~ ><))))( *> About Me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobWill Posted August 12, 2016 Share Posted August 12, 2016 These fossils with the five-way radial symmetry (minus one) have come up before but I forget what was decided. I have a columnal with a six petal body cavity, but I've only ever seen one. I do see what would be the right size for an associated cirrus on the first image, lower right so crinoid seems likely. Does anyone know which genus or family can exhibit this four-way symmetry instead of the usual five-way? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ischua Posted August 13, 2016 Author Share Posted August 13, 2016 This is driving me nuts! I can't find anything close to this four way pattern, The segments are round not flat with dimples around the OD. It would look like beads in a string if they were all strung., Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sixgill pete Posted August 13, 2016 Share Posted August 13, 2016 my first thought when seeing these is crinoid. But, I am far from an expert. Hopefully someone can come up with something definitive. Bulldozers and dirt Bulldozers and dirt behind the trailer, my desert Them red clay piles are heaven on earth I get my rocks off, bulldozers and dirt Patterson Hood; Drive-By Truckers May 2016 May 2012 Aug 2013, May 2016, Apr 2020 Oct 2022 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CraigHyatt Posted August 13, 2016 Share Posted August 13, 2016 Civil war bone buttons? Info: Craig Hyatt, retired software/electrical engineer Experience: Beginner, fossil hunting less than a year Location: Eagle Pass, TX USA on the border with Mexico, hot dry desert Formation: Escondido, Marine, Upper Cretaceous Materials: Sandstone, Mudstone, Shale, Chert, Chalk Typical: Thalassinoides, Sphenodiscus, Exogyra, Inoceramus Reference: http://txfossils.com/Txfossils.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobWill Posted August 13, 2016 Share Posted August 13, 2016 This is driving me nuts! I can't find anything close to this four way pattern, The segments are round not flat with dimples around the OD. It would look like beads in a string if they were all strung., If you mean spherical not disc-shaped it's driving me nuts too! That part wasn't clear from the pictures. I could swear I've seen this before but... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CraigHyatt Posted August 13, 2016 Share Posted August 13, 2016 I think what would help would be: 1. Exact diameter of as many as can be measured. 2. Side profile photo of as many as can be photographed. 3. Microphotograph of the surface. Info: Craig Hyatt, retired software/electrical engineer Experience: Beginner, fossil hunting less than a year Location: Eagle Pass, TX USA on the border with Mexico, hot dry desert Formation: Escondido, Marine, Upper Cretaceous Materials: Sandstone, Mudstone, Shale, Chert, Chalk Typical: Thalassinoides, Sphenodiscus, Exogyra, Inoceramus Reference: http://txfossils.com/Txfossils.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ischua Posted August 13, 2016 Author Share Posted August 13, 2016 (edited) It's about the size of a BB but with cupped ends where you see the holes the the sides are dimpled with small holes to the inner four. Could this be where the cirrus attach ? I can see 6 or 7 in the matrix all the same size. Edited August 13, 2016 by ischua Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ischua Posted August 13, 2016 Author Share Posted August 13, 2016 A little better side shot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CraigHyatt Posted August 13, 2016 Share Posted August 13, 2016 I haven't found any crinoids with 4-way symmetry yet. I also checked echinoids in case they were worn specimens. It seems significant there are a number grouped together like that. So the diameter is about 4.5 mm? Info: Craig Hyatt, retired software/electrical engineer Experience: Beginner, fossil hunting less than a year Location: Eagle Pass, TX USA on the border with Mexico, hot dry desert Formation: Escondido, Marine, Upper Cretaceous Materials: Sandstone, Mudstone, Shale, Chert, Chalk Typical: Thalassinoides, Sphenodiscus, Exogyra, Inoceramus Reference: http://txfossils.com/Txfossils.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DPS Ammonite Posted August 13, 2016 Share Posted August 13, 2016 (edited) Maybe the fossil is from an organism that has a different symmetry than normal. I have seen bearded iris and Trillium plants with 4 of everything instead of three. Could it be a blastoid? EDIT: There is another fossil in the lower right part of the rock to consider... crinoid column? Edited August 13, 2016 by DPS Ammonite 2 My goal is to leave no stone or fossil unturned. See my Arizona Paleontology Guide link The best single resource for Arizona paleontology anywhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CraigHyatt Posted August 13, 2016 Share Posted August 13, 2016 A little better side shot. IMG_1135.JPG Can you get full on side shot? I swear from that angle it looks like a fish vertebra. Info: Craig Hyatt, retired software/electrical engineer Experience: Beginner, fossil hunting less than a year Location: Eagle Pass, TX USA on the border with Mexico, hot dry desert Formation: Escondido, Marine, Upper Cretaceous Materials: Sandstone, Mudstone, Shale, Chert, Chalk Typical: Thalassinoides, Sphenodiscus, Exogyra, Inoceramus Reference: http://txfossils.com/Txfossils.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CraigHyatt Posted August 13, 2016 Share Posted August 13, 2016 Maybe the fossil is from an organism that has a different symmetry than normal. I have seen bearded iris and Trillium plants with 4 of everything instead of three. Could it be a blastoid? I had never heard of blastoids. Weird looking critters. ;-) Info: Craig Hyatt, retired software/electrical engineer Experience: Beginner, fossil hunting less than a year Location: Eagle Pass, TX USA on the border with Mexico, hot dry desert Formation: Escondido, Marine, Upper Cretaceous Materials: Sandstone, Mudstone, Shale, Chert, Chalk Typical: Thalassinoides, Sphenodiscus, Exogyra, Inoceramus Reference: http://txfossils.com/Txfossils.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CraigHyatt Posted August 13, 2016 Share Posted August 13, 2016 This is off the wall: from my robotics experience, if the 4 channels were for muscles and the center for nervous system, this would be an animal that wriggled in three dimensions like a worm, not two dimensions like a fish. That's assuming these are some sort of vertebrae. Info: Craig Hyatt, retired software/electrical engineer Experience: Beginner, fossil hunting less than a year Location: Eagle Pass, TX USA on the border with Mexico, hot dry desert Formation: Escondido, Marine, Upper Cretaceous Materials: Sandstone, Mudstone, Shale, Chert, Chalk Typical: Thalassinoides, Sphenodiscus, Exogyra, Inoceramus Reference: http://txfossils.com/Txfossils.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobWill Posted August 13, 2016 Share Posted August 13, 2016 I had never heard of blastoids. Weird looking critters. ;-) You won't find them in Texas Craig. Those walnut-on-a-stalk-looking echinoiderms can be had in Oklahoma though but since they also have five-way symmetry I think we can rule them out too. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobWill Posted August 13, 2016 Share Posted August 13, 2016 (edited) It's about the size of a BB but with cupped ends where you see the holes the the sides are dimpled with small holes to the inner four. Could this be where the cirrus attach ? I can see 6 or 7 in the matrix all the same size. Cirri attach on a node rather than a dimple or hole. The small size of the string of segments is what made me think of a cirra rather than a column. The smallest crinoids can be just a few millimeters though so maybe that only left room for four-way symmetry Edited August 13, 2016 by BobWill 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DPS Ammonite Posted August 13, 2016 Share Posted August 13, 2016 I found 2 types of animals with 4 fold symmetry: box jellies (I have never seen hard parts) and conularids which have hard shells including a piece at the bottom to attach themselves to an object (the fossil?). See Wikipedia links: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conulariida https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Box_jellyfish 1 My goal is to leave no stone or fossil unturned. See my Arizona Paleontology Guide link The best single resource for Arizona paleontology anywhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DPS Ammonite Posted August 13, 2016 Share Posted August 13, 2016 Don't discount the possibility that it may be a button in a manmade rock such as concrete or the lesser possibity of a recent naturally cemented rock such as gravel cemented in a calcium rich spring or creek. 1 My goal is to leave no stone or fossil unturned. See my Arizona Paleontology Guide link The best single resource for Arizona paleontology anywhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ischua Posted August 13, 2016 Author Share Posted August 13, 2016 Can you get full on side shot? I swear from that angle it looks like a fish vertebra. I will try to get better picture in the morning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CraigHyatt Posted August 13, 2016 Share Posted August 13, 2016 This is interesting. It has "hard parts" that are not described. https://ucrtoday.ucr.edu/22458 Info: Craig Hyatt, retired software/electrical engineer Experience: Beginner, fossil hunting less than a year Location: Eagle Pass, TX USA on the border with Mexico, hot dry desert Formation: Escondido, Marine, Upper Cretaceous Materials: Sandstone, Mudstone, Shale, Chert, Chalk Typical: Thalassinoides, Sphenodiscus, Exogyra, Inoceramus Reference: http://txfossils.com/Txfossils.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CraigHyatt Posted August 13, 2016 Share Posted August 13, 2016 (edited) Don't discount the possibility that it may be a button in a manmade rock such as concrete or the lesser possibity of a recent naturally cemented rock such as gravel cemented in a calcium rich spring or creek.Absolutely. Look higher in the thread at the civil war bone button. Near perfect match face on. Not sure about side view.Only problem is the buttons I saw online were the size of a US dime (18 mm). The specimens at hand are the size of a BB (4.5 mm). Edited August 13, 2016 by CraigHyatt Info: Craig Hyatt, retired software/electrical engineer Experience: Beginner, fossil hunting less than a year Location: Eagle Pass, TX USA on the border with Mexico, hot dry desert Formation: Escondido, Marine, Upper Cretaceous Materials: Sandstone, Mudstone, Shale, Chert, Chalk Typical: Thalassinoides, Sphenodiscus, Exogyra, Inoceramus Reference: http://txfossils.com/Txfossils.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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