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Kimi64

A shark tooth with it's own kickstand & a few friends

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Kimi64

 I decided to work on my lighting setup & I think I am getting closer. These are some of my favorite teeth from the past year. The one on the right end is not leaning against the backdrop, it is actually 3-dimensional, almost as if it has a built in kickstand or tripod. I don't know which species it belongs too. The caramel colored one is my absolute favorite so far, I was shocked to find that one last fall on the beach, just barely on the edge of the waves.IMG_20180227_225448.thumb.jpg.089c24714deadc27cf35a6c8234dc683.jpg

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Anomotodon

Two middle ones are Miocene-Pliocene Hemipristis serra, left one could be Otodus obliquus from Eocene or Paleocene (I think there are Eocene formations in Maryland) and right ones could be a species of mako or even something else, more pictures and locality info will make it easier to ID.

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caldigger

Thinking the three on the right are all Hemipristis. Middle and far right are lowers, caramel is upper and can't make out what far left is.

Any more pics from other side?

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Kimi64

I just realized the one on the far left is from Douglas Point. All of the other 3 are Flag Ponds. I was having trouble with the "kickstand" tooth, I couldn't get a good photo from the opposite side without causing a shadow. Maybe I should lay it down so everyone can see the protuberance at the base that allows it to stand on its own. At least I am getting brighter photographs now. 

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Anomotodon

According to the forum, Douglas point is Paleogene, so left one should be Otodus. About right one - @caldigger should be right about it being Hemipristis lower, I forgot about them, though more pictures would definitely help.

 

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HoppeHunting

The "kickstand" tooth is a lower Hemipristis serra tooth. They have a huge protuberance on the lingual side, just below the start of the crown. Because of how large the bump is, it almost does appear to be a third root lobe, making for a tripod-like appearance. 

 

Here is a side view of a lower H. serra tooth, showing the protuberance. 

 

 

hemi side.jpg

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Ludwigia

I'll go along with lower H.serra. Here's one of mine with a kickstand on the left.

 

P52b.jpg.aecf597a85e2d02a78d84487adbbd504.jpg

 

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Macrophyseter

I second/third/fourth everyone.

Like everyone said, the two middle teeth are front the extinct snaggletooth Hemipristis serra, with the 2nd one being an upper and 3rd being a lower. For future reference, H. serra teeth are characterized by their enormous serrations. Upper teeth are broad-ish and have a curved crown, with usually the distal (concave) edge having larger serrations, although this does not apply to all uppers. Lower teeth are spear-like and are straight in a front-view angle, but have protuberance at a side-view.

 

The tooth on the far left, I've had some thoughts that Cretolamna may also be it, but there are some striation/vein/line marks on the top of the root, which resembles the signature Otodus/Carcharocles bourlette, so I'll also stand with Otodus obliquus.

 

I think the far right tooth is probably a lower anterior shortfin mako tooth Isurus oxyrinchus, with the long root lobes, spear-like crown, protuberance (based on light reflection on the photo), and lack of of lateral cusplets (little crown-like parts that are next to both sides of the main crown), but I may be wrong.

 

Nice finds btw!

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Tidgy's Dad

Nice teeth! 

Very nice finds. :)

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snolly50
8 hours ago, Kimi64 said:

At least I am getting brighter photographs now. 

Your photograph is very well done. Draping the backdrop might improve the image by eliminating the distracting dark seam running behind the teeth. That is, using material that goes from the "floor" up the vertical "wall" without a seam. In addition, photographing the black teeth separately from the lighter colored ones will allow for exposure adjustment; that is best for each. I look forward to seeing more of your photos.

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HoppeHunting
6 hours ago, Macrophyseter said:

I second/third/fourth everyone.

Like everyone said, the two middle teeth are front the extinct snaggletooth Hemipristis serra, with the 2nd one being an upper and 3rd being a lower. For future reference, H. serra teeth are characterized by their enormous serrations. Upper teeth are broad-ish and have a curved crown, with usually the distal (concave) edge having larger serrations, although this does not apply to all uppers. Lower teeth are spear-like and are straight in a front-view angle, but have protuberance at a side-view.

 

The tooth on the far left, I've had some thoughts that Cretolamna may also be it, but there are some striation/vein/line marks on the top of the root, which resembles the signature Otodus/Carcharocles bourlette, so I'll also stand with Otodus obliquus.

 

I think the far right tooth is probably a lower anterior shortfin mako tooth Isurus oxyrinchus, with the long root lobes, spear-like crown, protuberance (based on light reflection on the photo), and lack of of lateral cusplets (little crown-like parts that are next to both sides of the main crown), but I may be wrong.

 

Nice finds btw!

I agree with most of this. The far left is likely Cretolamna but like you said, there does appear to be a possible bourlette. If it is in fact O. obliquus then it's a really tiny one. Hard to tell because it's broken and worn. I don't believe the far right is Isurus though. While Mako teeth usually do have very thick root centers, the "kickstand" being described sounds much more like a lower H. serra. Also, the shiny enamel on the labial side is typical of lower Hemis. See @Ludwigia's example. To be sure, we'd need @Kimi64 to post a side view picture. Even if it's not the best quality, the general shape could be enough to draw a conclusion.

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Littlefoot

I can't contribute to the ID effort, but I just wanted to say that those are NICE teeth! 

 

I think your photos are fantastic too! I can make out all the details!

 

If you want, you can actually make a simple backdrop with a white piece of paper or posterboard. Tape the top to the wall, then have it curve along the wall and tape it to the floor. You can also make a cheap lightbox (directions at this website: https://www.wikihow.com/Create-an-Inexpensive-Photography-Lightbox). Full disclaimer: I've never actually made a lightbox, as time always seem to get away from me, but I dream about making one! One day!

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Anomotodon
1 hour ago, HoppeFossilHunting said:

The far left is likely Cretolamna but like you said, there does appear to be a possible bourlette. If it is in fact O. obliquus then it's a really tiny one. Hard to tell because it's broken and worn.

 

According to the last revision, no CretAlamna species are described from Cenozoic and C. appediculata as a species is only Turonian in age. In Cenozoic it is very hard to draw the line between Cretalamna and O. obliquus since they represent a continuous lineage. Although, Paleocene smaller Cretalamna-early Otodus-like are sometimes described as Otodus obliquus var. minor or, less frequently, O. minor. So, especially if this is an Eocene tooth, I think it is safe to call it O. obliquus, regarding root protuberance and that size doesn't matter that much.

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Al Dente
26 minutes ago, Anomotodon said:

 

According to the last revision, no CretAlamna species are described from Cenozoic and C. appediculata as a species is only Turonian in age. In Cenozoic it is very hard to draw the line between Cretalamna and O. obliquus since they represent a continuous lineage. Although, Paleocene smaller Cretalamna-early Otodus-like are sometimes described as Otodus obliquus var. minor or, less frequently, O. minor. So, especially if this is an Eocene tooth, I think it is safe to call it O. obliquus, regarding root protuberance and that size doesn't matter that much.

There are Cenozoic Cretolamna, Mikael Siversson has mentioned them on the Forum here-http://www.thefossilforum.com/index.php?/topic/47908-shark-tooth-from-andalusia-alabama/&do=findComment&comment=517604

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Anomotodon
3 minutes ago, Al Dente said:

There are Cenozoic Cretolamna, Mikael Siversson has mentioned them on the Forum here-http://www.thefossilforum.com/index.php?/topic/47908-shark-tooth-from-andalusia-alabama/&do=findComment&comment=517604

Thanks for the link, this is why I carefully formulated "no species described" :)

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WhodamanHD
12 hours ago, Anomotodon said:

Paleogene

Late Paleocene with a little Eocene washed in.

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Kimi64

Thank you everyone for the great discussion. Much appreciated. 

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