Fossil finding ethics?

[adguy3]

1 hour ago, Carl said:

I'm not seeing a single detail in the entire lot that suggests a fossil of any kind.

Thanks for the look. 

[jpc]

Hello and welcome from Wyoming....

I also am not seeing any bones here.  They have suggestive shapes, but there is no bone texture to any of them.  Sorry to say.  I say this as a guy who works with dinosaurs every day and collects literally tons of dino bones every summer.  At least two others who have replied and not seen bones are also well seasoned in the dino bones business.  Do have a look at @troodon's ID pages (I'll let him share the links).  Shape and texture is what we look for, be it dinosaur or any other fossilized bones. 

 

On the other hand, you are not the first to be caught by suggestive rocks.  And, this site is a great place for beginners to learn about their finds.    

Edited April 7, 2022 by jpc

[Boesse]

Sadly there are no bones amongst any of the pictured specimens. These all appear to be rock fragments or possibly phosphate/siderite nodules.

[adguy3]

On 4/7/2022 at 6:43 PM, Boesse said:

Sadly there are no bones amongst any of the pictured specimens. These all appear to be rock fragments or possibly phosphate/siderite nodules.

I appreciate the look, but I was not soliciting guesses when I posted those pics. I was only reacting to a member who seemed impatient for pics so I threw up what was on my bench for research. 4 pieces out of literally thousands. 

If I decide to post pics for identification, I'll clean them up, take better pics, post them in the proper section and give the context necessary to help.. Then invite input. 

 

I gotta say, it seems the the MO of the group is "rock until proven otherwise, you dumb newbie." Although some were more polite than others.

I get it.

Some amateur jumps in with grand claims so the natural position is that he doesn't know what he's talking about. And I'm sure that more times than not, it IS a rock.
Fair enough. But, for members with no significant finds or credentials to claim "rock" with certainty from a poor pic, isn't just B.S., it will potentially discourage real finds. 

 

Not all directed at you Boesse. I'm just disappointed at the speed and joy members seem to relish in when "helping" you identify pieces.

 

My original question was regarding the ethics and the forum has helped guide me down the right path for reporting and getting the right people involved.

Thank you all for that. I'm in contact with some local professionals that could help.

 

 

I may not post pics for identifying, but I will keep my promise to give an update when I have one- either way.

 

Thank you.

[Boesse]

I naturally understand that this isn't what you were asking for, but reporting this to a local paleontologist/geologist won't be necessary, and quite frankly, we (paleontologists) get requests to look at piles of rocks all the time.

 

Regardless, I hope for your sake, and the sake of anyone you ask to see specimens in person, that these were not the 'highlights' of the collection and that there are some real bones in there. We *want* people to make great discoveries! But we're also healthy skeptics. And, as far as credentials, are concerned there's an immense amount of experience among the "amateur" collectors who have responded to you - and at least three paleontologists who work at museums (myself included). It's certainly possible that the photos are poor quality, but you can always remedy that with better photos (I actually think they're fine, everything is in focus, I can tell some are common rock/mineral types, and I do not see any evidence of bone grain/texture or shell).

 

Keep on digging! Let us know if you find something great.

Edited April 10, 2022 by Boesse

[JohnJ]

38 minutes ago, adguy3 said:

Some amateur jumps in with grand claims so the natural position is that he doesn't know what he's talking about.

 

Your fundamental premise is wrong in this assumption.  Members of this group could care less if you are an amateur or newbie.  Like Bobby mentioned, we want to see new discoveries made, and this forum is full of thousands of examples...many from new members.  

 

At the same time, we want to educate people to be able to distinguish between "just a rock" and a definite fossil.  Criteria are important.

[adguy3]

9 minutes ago, Boesse said:

I naturally understand that this isn't what you were asking for, but reporting this to a local paleontologist/geologist won't be necessary, and quite frankly, we (paleontologists) get requests to look at piles of rocks all the time.

 

Regardless, I hope for your sake, and the sake of anyone you ask to see specimens in person, that these were not the 'highlights' of the collection and that there are some real bones in there. We *want* people to make great discoveries! But we're also healthy skeptics. And, as far as credentials, are concerned there's an immense amount of experience among the "amateur" collectors who have responded to you - and at least three paleontologists who work at museums (myself included). It's certainly possible that the photos are poor quality, but you can always remedy that with better photos (I actually think they're fine, everything is in focus, I can tell some are common rock/mineral types, and I do not see any evidence of bone grain/texture or shell).

 

Keep on digging! Let us know if you find something great.

Thanks so much for this. 

I've also been burned on another forum a few months ago when what was post was definitely a specimen but people weighed in (incorrectly) as to why it couldn't be.

I didn't mean to offend real scientists like yourself, but when I looked at some of the unsolicited commenters, there wasn't anything in their postings or profile that showed their extensive finds or expertise.

I will certainly post some good pics of better pieces for you.

 

Thanks again.

[adguy3]

9 minutes ago, JohnJ said:

 

Your fundamental premise is wrong in this assumption.  Members of this group could care less if you are an amateur or newbie.  Like Bobby mentioned, we want to see new discoveries made, and this forum is full of thousands of examples...many from new members.  

 

At the same time, we want to educate people to be able to distinguish between "just a rock" and a definite fossil.  Criteria are important.

Thanks John. You are right, The generalization of it being the group MO was unfair. Just the feeling I got from some commenters.

[Brandy Cole]

When I first came here as a total amateur, it was people without academic credentials who consistently surprised me with their tremendous knowledge and experience.  Their willingness to comment on posts I made helped me sort quickly between finds that were legitimate fossils and finds that weren't.  The more answers I got, the better I became at differentiating for myself.

Someone does not have to have 'significant scientific discoveries' or academic credentials under their belts to quickly differentiate between rock and potential fossil.  Years of experience and self study differentiating between the two makes many here tremendously qualified.

[adguy3]

8 hours ago, Brandy Cole said:

When I first came here as a total amateur, it was people without academic credentials who consistently surprised me with their tremendous knowledge and experience.  Their willingness to comment on posts I made helped me sort quickly between finds that were legitimate fossils and finds that weren't.  The more answers I got, the better I became at differentiating for myself.

Someone does not have to have 'significant scientific discoveries' or academic credentials under their belts to quickly differentiate between rock and potential fossil.  Years of experience and self study differentiating between the two makes many here tremendously qualified.

Thanks @Brandy Cole