Examples of Commonly Faked Dino Eggs

[Joseph Richardson]

Thanks for the news feed. I collect fossils from around the world and was thinking of adding a dinosaur egg to my collection but I'm going to stay away from online sites now.  On a recent trip to Morroco I purchased some fine fossils from a museum where David Attenborough hosted a documentry called 'Bigger Than T-Rex"  I was warned about by the curator of the museum that 95% of Morrocan fossils are fake. Buyer beware if you're travelling there.

[Tidgy's Dad]

2 hours ago, Joseph Richardson said:

Thanks for the news feed. I collect fossils from around the world and was thinking of adding a dinosaur egg to my collection but I'm going to stay away from online sites now.  On a recent trip to Morroco I purchased some fine fossils from a museum where David Attenborough hosted a documentry called 'Bigger Than T-Rex"  I was warned about by the curator of the museum that 95% of Morrocan fossils are fake. Buyer beware if you're travelling there.

Hello, and a very warm welcome to TFF from Morocco! 

That is a massive exaggeration. 

Indeed, buyer beware, here as everywhere, but it is nowhere near 50% let alone 95. 

[aeon.rocks]

Welcome to the forum! What does a topic on dinosaur eggs have to do with Moroccan fossils? Moroccans fake dinosaur eggs now too?  

 

Many resellers will tell you a story... It's good for business. Especially if you add a story how good job he or she is doing to sell only good quality and all natural... Can't blame them, it's marketing! Resellers in USA or EU could tell you a similar story 10x times over and a story how they guarantee authenticity and quality. Preselection is a fact, but most resellers just buy from Moroccan sellers... And with a story about trust, resell with a profit. Don't hate me for saying it, it's how the market works and not a secret. Trust and marketing mean a lot!

 

Most fossils in the open market are commercial grade, takes a lot of effort to find good quality preserved or prepared fossils, but to say 95% of moroccan fossils are fake, is a joke. There are good and bad apples, like always, but plenty of real fossils to go around. Yes, fakes are around, but in case of Morocco that has become almost a stereotype now. I'm thankful to know now almost 95% of Moroccan fossils are considered fake!  Nothing new, but if you knew the truth behind Moroccan fossil trade, I am sure you would feel disgusted sharing such comments nowadays, so don't sell buyer beware stories without facts, you would do more good if you tell people to learn and seek information and knowledge instead - to learn how to separate weeds from.... 

 

https://www.facebook.com/FosiliSlovenije/photos/a.516367441716638/2099452500074783/?type=3&theater

 

 

https://www.facebook.com/FosiliSlovenije/photos/a.516367441716638/2104092022944164/?type=3&theater

 

 

https://www.facebook.com/FosiliSlovenije/photos/a.516367441716638/2100241656662534/?type=3&theater

 

 

 

https://www.facebook.com/FosiliSlovenije/photos/a.516367441716638/2099452500074783/?type=3&theater

 

 

[DPS Ammonite]

EDIT: The perceived percent of fake Moroccan fossils is too high because of the actions of a few. Sometimes governments need to be proactive and go after the few to protect the reputation of the majority.

 

 

The Moroccan sellers could improve their reputation if they properly labeled and disclosed all restorations/recreations/fakes etc. I have not seen any totally plastic/ fake fossils from Morocco that had the term “reproduction” or like imprinted into the specimen. How many times do the Moroccan sellers include a label or imprintation into the rock that says that the only thing real in the skull are the tips of the teeth. Some may consider a fossil fake if any undisclosed restoration has been done thus increasing the total percentage of fake fossils.

 

As long as Morocco allows fossils to leave the county without proper labels and disclosures their reputation will suffer. Few people want to buy goods that are sold with a buyer beware and we won’t tell if you don’t ask policy.

 

[JohnJ]

Fakes are not limited to any geographic area.  Generalizations of any specific region are often oversimplifications and inaccurate.

 

Education is the key to any quality purchase.

[aeon.rocks]

1 hour ago, DPS Ammonite said:

The Moroccan sellers could improve their reputation if they properly labeled and disclosed all restorations/recreations/fakes etc. I have not seen any totally plastic/ fake fossils from Morocco that had the term “reproduction” or like imprinted into the specimen. How many times do the Moroccan sellers include a label or imprintation into the rock that says that the only thing real in the skull are the tips of the teeth. Some may consider a fossil fake if any undisclosed restoration has been done thus increasing the total percentage of fake fossils.

 

As long as Morocco allows fossils to leave the county without proper labels and disclosures their reputation will suffer. Few people want to buy goods that are sold with a buyer beware and we won’t tell if you don’t ask policy.

 

 

I'm not gonna argue about non-disclosed restoration/fakes/repairs, and this is not the topic for such discussion, but I think is worth noting that resellers of Moroccan fakes online and Moroccan guys prepping bugs and Moroccan guys making fake Mosasaur jaws and Moroccan guys digging kem kem material are not the same guys... Many moroccan sellers are very honest about restoration and fakes, often a lot more as some resellers, who buy these cheap "fakes" (knowing what they are), but then resell them online without full disclosure (just because it's profitable).

 

Yes, most Mosasaur jaws you see sold cheap are fake, but that is not the case of devonian Moroccan trilobites, and again is different n case of cambrian bugs... Again, guys prepping these and those are usually not the same... 

 

Quote

As long as Morocco allows fossils to leave the county without proper labels and disclosures their reputation will suffer.

 

That's funny, because I don't see any country banning fakes (and not even fossil-show organizators in USA) and I also see just as many labels on restored EU, USA or Russian material as on Moroccan. In the end it all comes down to sellers and professionalism of distribution.

 

I understand it's easier to blame all Moroccans and tell buyer beware stories about 95% Moroccan fake fossils, as to seek information and learn how to keep bad resellers off the market! 

 

It's exactly this logic, that gets some buyers into trouble, looking for a bargain, without even knowing what you are buying:

 

https://www.facebook.com/FosiliSlovenije/photos/a.516367441716638/2100241656662534/?type=3&theater

 

[DPS Ammonite]

1 hour ago, aeon.rocks said:

That's funny, because I don't see any country banning fakes (and not even fossil-show organizators in USA)

I have read the rules that regulate the vendors at shows. Most allow the organizers to ask dealers to relabel or withdraw from sale, items that are mislabeled. Whether or not those rules are enforced is another story. 

[Joseph Richardson]

Thank you for the spirited response to my fake Morrocan fossil claims. I spent a month in Morroco and watched the fossil diggers remove stone from a site, transport it to a prepping area where they were teased from the rock using fine dental and Dremel type tools. A real work of art. I appreciate the time and labour put into finding and preping these fossils and the high price they ask for them reflects that. But I can't count the number of shops I visited where the price of a fossil was in the hundreds of dollars when I walked in and suddenly dropped to two dollars on my way out. To me, that sounds like it just may be fake. Unless it's from a reputable, known dealer, museum or private collection,  I would be wary.  

[aeon.rocks]

16 minutes ago, Joseph Richardson said:

 But I can't count the number of shops I visited where the price of a fossil was in the hundreds of dollars when I walked in and suddenly dropped to two dollars on my way out. To me, that sounds like it just may be fake. Unless it's from a reputable, known dealer, museum or private collection,  I would be wary.  

 

In Morocco haggling is common in doing business and many people depend on making the sale. Usually price they ask for them does not reflect the time and labour, if you compare it to western world rates however, so it's often possible to acquire Moroccan fossils very cheap. What was the preparation quality, raritiy, species (price depends on) of fossils you were offered I can not say, so I can not say if you were offered real very common fossils, but haggling is not uncommon and price of very common fossils often too low...

 

You need to know what you are buying, don't rely on modesty and kindness of any dealers, known, reputable or not... After all, most buy moroccan material directly from Moroccans. 

[Tidgy's Dad]

Haggling is the way of doing business. I love it. One goes to a supermarket or shop with fixed prices and you often have to pay stupid prices well over the odds, but with haggling both parties feel happy with the deal. It's not just for tourists, this is the culture. But the more money they think you have the more they will ask to begin with. Carpets are another example, they will start with a price that you could buy a house for, but come down to a really decent amount if you play the game, have a glass of tea and complain about the workmanship, the weight, the colour, how you have 6 children you cannot afford to feed, etc. A massive reduction in price is not an indication of a product's authenticity. Dealers will even sell at a loss if they've had a bad day and need a few dirham to buy bread for that night. 

I'm not sure a month is long enough to judge a whole culture.  

[aeon.rocks]

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It's not just for tourists, this is the culture.

 

 

Exactly! In Morocco... But in USA people are more used to pay a high price, like 1200$ for 30 common flexicalymene trilobites.   

[Joseph Richardson]

I have lived, worked and travelled to many compass point on the planet. I know cultures. I know bartering. I know haggling. I don't go on Granny Tours or travel 5 star. I may not be a fossil expert but I do know when someone is trying to sell me a fake one.

[aeon.rocks]

You actually don't, because as you say you don't know fake from real, you probably don't even know what species of fossils you were offered,  the rest is just your personal speculation.

[Joseph Richardson]

No, it's not speculation. It's called experience. When someone drops their price from extremely high to extremely low in a few minutes I don't have to know the specie of a fossil or anything else for that matter. Just common sense.

[aeon.rocks]

Experience based on what?

 

My common sense tells me, it could have been a very common fossil and seller tried to sell you the USA price first, when you showed no interest he dropped it, as mentioned haggling is in the Moroccan culture and if a seller had a bad day and needed money... But I don't know, because it's just my speculation, not knowing what fossil it was - which probably from what you were saying, you don't know either. My common sense also tells me, some would much prefer to buy that same Moroccan fossil from a well known ("trusted") USA or EU reseller for a hundred or two or five hundreds dollars more, because they feel safe paying the huge margin. Good luck! All I'm saying, learn to know what you are buying, if you keep your interest in fossils or minerals...

[Fotsirk]

Anyone an idea of this egg 

its found in Mongolia and it should be an Oviraptor egg

  

 

[HamptonsDoc]

This one doesn't look right to me.  If you notice the markings on the shell in the last image... they should match up across the cracks and they don't.  This may be real shell but I think the egg is a composite.

[Fotsirk]

Thanks

Here is some other pictures  one is from the same crack but other angle if u look at the crack on the bottom of the picture us see some shell match up  and other 2 are from  other cracks 

[HamptonsDoc]

Some areas look alright, others don't which is why I'm weary of this one and think its most likely a composite.  Its much easier to get a strong sense when viewing these in person.  Oviraptor eggs are not very rare and if you wait you will find one that is not so suspicious.

[Jackson g]

Just read the whole forum. Killer, post results if you read this please. Anxious for the conclusion lol.

[Oxytropidoceras]

My favorite fake dinosaur eggs were for sale at a gem and mineral show, which shall remain nameless, here in Louisiana. They were claystone concretions being sold by a dealer as "shell-less dinosaur eggs." The dealer explained that they were dinosaur "eggs" that were laid without shells. I wish I could have taken a picture. They were priced at 150 dollars each. 

[Mark Kmiecik]

This one is "expelling an embryo".

 

[RuMert]

[Jeff O]

Great thread, very informative. I registered an account just to contribute. I got this "egg" from someone asking if I could verify its authenticity, though he was skeptical. Unfortunately it has a lot of signs otherwise... He could not tell me where it came from other than he got it from his dad many years ago. The shell missing is in a baggie that I have if I decide to piece it back together.  Looks most like they were going for oviraptor but it's large. The matrix is of different colors and it would be a whole egg if I put it together. Purple image is under UV, does not add much. Any other thoughts? Anyone know where it may have come from or how it was made?

[Nickflemo]

Hi team,

I would really appreciate your opinion on this egg cluster. 
From Asian origins and they state they are Elongatoolithidae

Any advice would be great. 
cheers

nick